Determining demand & feasibility for your SSI/VC use case
Determining Demand & Feasibility For Your SSI/VC Use Case
Session: 12H
Convener: Timothy Ruff
Notes-taker(s): Jonas Jetschni
Tags for the session - technology discussed/ideas considered:
Discussion notes, key understandings, outstanding questions, observations, and, if appropriate to this discussion: action items, next steps:
Presentation based on following document: http://docs.google.com/document/d/1_Usxxug9jubChP1yfNjE0wOKFfQYr3eebwAW8QyZCVg/edit#
Key challenge for the SSI space “if you build they will come” - talk to your customer, fall in love with their problems and understand what they want
Five Steps to determine market demand
- Know your ideal issuer, holder and verifiers
- Find market viability with the verifier by speaking with them
- Test interest and capability of issuers by speaking with them
- If interest or capability of issuer is weak, build pressure through verifier / holder demand
- If you don't get your ideal issuer, talk to Proxy Issuer
Onfido integrated with Evernym Connect.me wallet, has the capability to issue VCs. Onfido is issuing credentials as part of the UK legal sandbox with Evernym Connect.me wallet and uport wallet. Legal is still a challenge for Onfido, mainly due to legal cost to make it work
For many identity provider, legal obligations is a challenge, e.g. Lucy Yang to Everyone: “cannot support your requirements due to our contractual obligation with our data vendors that prevent us from having this business relationship with organizations who provide any sort of identity certification, including self sovereign identity.”
NetKey is able to issue verifiable credentials
Credit unions moving towards product as they want to go touchless (~500.000 people)
- Credit unions issues credential to member
- Member presents this credential to credit union
- Issuer/verifier same Authority but not same department
To reduce complexity of driving adoption with issuer/verifier/holder, combine issuer/verifier in one authority. This will serve GTM efforts.
Every customer of an IAM solution provider is an ideal target customer for SSI. Advantage of VCs, the addressable market is bigger as they allow for context switching.
IAM players have not moved into SSI due to the innovator's dilemma, they are making money and growing
People spending time and money on tech, without talking to customers and understanding their real needs
Book recommendation: Running Lean: Iterate from Plan A to a Plan That Works. Avoid spending time on building code. You can find product market fit without building.
Great compromise between building a prototype and slide deck is a clickable prototype
SSI stories and SSI could explode this year
SSI Tracker: Track momentum, Startups, Consortia
The industry needs to start understanding what is happening in the community
Showcasing demand to governments can be a driver for adoption.
Eat your vegetables ;-)
Zoom Chat log:
From Timothy Ruff to Everyone: 11:02 PM
http://docs.google.com/document/d/1_Usxxug9jubChP1yfNjE0wOKFfQYr3eebwAW8QyZCVg/edit#
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 11:05 PM
Fallacy: If you build it, they will come.
From Tushar Phondge to Everyone: 11:06 PM Totally agree @johnnyfc
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 11:06 PM Solutions looking for problems. ;-)
From Juan Caballero to Everyone: 11:07 PM AKA "notary" issuers
From Cam Geer to Everyone: 11:10 PM like Okta for IAM
From Derick Grey to Everyone: 11:11 PM And most of them are actually laying off or reducing IT workforce because other tests have significantly reduced.
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 11:12 PM The steps are necessary, but not sufficient…
From Cam Geer to Everyone: 11:15 PM core product discovery work — customer problem discovery // product solution discovery
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 11:15 PM It’s a decentralized consensus problem!
From Cam Geer to Everyone: 11:17 PM it’s the product manager’s job to synthesize the customer input’s to create an organizational consensus toward something that is worth doing
From Juan Caballero to Everyone: 11:17 PM I think there's some companies here at IIW
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 11:17 PM Onfido
From Juan Caballero to Everyone: 11:21 PM I can't blame them
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 11:22 PM http://onfido.com Legal seems to be a key blocker
From Dima Postnikov to Everyone: 11:22 PM Liability…
From Juan Caballero to Everyone: 11:23 PM Yeah, Riley's accurate-- they wouldn't issue VCs for us, but were happy to let us issue credentials based on the results of their API calls
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 11:23 PM Timothy says: Revenue trumps legal
From Juan Caballero to Everyone: 11:23 PM LEGALLY (not technically) they said they weren't issuing any time seen soon
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 11:24 PM OK, Timothy did not say “exactly” that. :-)
From Lucy Yang to Everyone: 11:24 PM cannot support your requirements due to our contractual obligation with our data vendors that prevent us from having this business relationship with organizations who provide any sort of identity certification, including self sovereign identity.
From Juan Caballero to Everyone: 11:26 PM !!! congratulations everyone, we're officially a threat to other business models :D Onfido told us they were very bullish on SSI long-term, just not issuing now (side note: amazing)
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 11:28 PM Indeed. Although “better” solutions have often died on the vine… LaserDisc, Betamax,...
From Juan Caballero to Everyone: 11:30 PM ^ This is actually my biggest concern about onfido, tbh--- something about the timing of their round makes me think all covid ID functions will be powered by "AI", not SSI...
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 11:30 PM Yay! Credit Unions going to Production!
From Andre Kudra to Everyone: 11:30 PM Johnny, I had LaserDisc! Still a fan. Anyways into retro-tech. ;-)
From Paul Jackson to Everyone: 11:33 PM Do you have a list of all the VC use cases going to production? Would be good to find out more about the credit union examples and others. Having that list alone would help to encourage others to move to production. Few want to be the first, encouraging for others to see that they aren't the only ones going forward.
From Cam Geer to Everyone: 11:33 PM this is the problem / opportunity I want to chase
From Stew Whitman to Everyone: 11:35 PM Just joining, Was there a link to the Google doc chared?
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 11:35 PM Notes: If possible, make Issuer & Verify the same entity (make one of your variables a constant).
From Juan Caballero to Everyone: 11:36 PM They're more likely to do all employee testing at gunpoint Ah, interesting she makes an interesting point re: cross-context VCs
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 11:37 PM http://docs.google.com/document/d/1_Usxxug9jubChP1yfNjE0wOKFfQYr3eebwAW8QyZCVg/edit
From Bill Wendel1 to Everyone: 11:37 PM Agree, Paul. I’m interested in real estate use cases. My experience is that some credit unions offer residential mortgages in-house, and others outsource the process to a service center. As fiduciaries, credit unions have a trust relationship that can be turbo-charged as their mission is to help members save money. So, yes, the cost saving approach should sell.
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 11:39 PM Notes: IAM have not moved in this direction - Innovator’s Dilemma: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Innovator%27s_Dilemma
From Juan Caballero to Everyone: 11:40 PM Awesome, thanks for having me, I'm gonna butterfly around to some other sessions!
From Matt Norton to Everyone: 11:41 PM
Getting that list might be difficult, many firms going to market are still in stealth about it
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 11:42 PM Another emergent incentive is to alleviate the cost risk of liability due to rising data protection regulation (whether agree or not).
From Paul Jackson to Everyone: 11:43 PM Even having a starter (and evergreen) list would be helpful. Even a couple of examples would help. The National Health Service example is a good one but more examples are needed. Even details on the Credit Union ones would be big.
From Derick Grey to Everyone: 11:45 PM YAS Leans!
From Cam Geer to Everyone: 11:46 PM http://www.amazon.com/Running-Lean-Iterate-Plan-Works/dp/1449305172/ref=sr_1_1?crid=W5XTI966GDHT&dchild=1&keywords=running+lean+ash+maurya&qid=1588196784&sprefix=running+lean%2Caps%2C196&sr=8-1
From Vic Cooper to Everyone: 11:48 PM http://www.albertosavoia.com/therightit.html
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 11:50 PM There is a strategy that some contemporary startups follow is to grab money and make a solution. See also: Is the Lean Startup Dead? http://steveblank.com/2018/09/05/is-the-lean-startup-dead
From Cam Geer to Everyone: 11:54 PM and publish the stats in real time!
From Matt Norton to Everyone: 11:54 PM Bill Gates’ digital credential quote
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 11:54 PM The problem with standards… the aren’t. ;-) Actually, I think that the “meta” philosophy of providers like Sovrin, Hyperledger, etc., sounds good in theory. But it also fragments the market - ripe for corporate capture.
From Darran Rolls to Everyone: 11:55 PM Can you share the doc link here
From Timothy Ruff to Everyone: 11:57 PM http://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1egn-ZXVSD_LMPpJVZdD12d_VvLMIPpYrFJdLmOOlqNE/edit#gid=0
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 11:59 PM Notes: Portable identity “Transitive Trust”
From Cam Geer to Everyone: 12:01 AM it is an info / PR war
From Brian Richter to Everyone: 12:01 AM Whos Vick? Oh nevermind
From Timothy Ruff to Everyone: 12:01 AM the guy speakin
[:)]
From Cam Geer to Everyone: 12:01 AM Founder of HearRo http://www.hearro.com/
From Timothy Ruff to Everyone: 12:02 AM Paul jump in when Vic is done
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 12:04 AM It’s a war of information & “truth”. Beware the “Industrial Complex”. Numerous domains have been taken over by entities that have coopted the terminology, concepts, meme, fad, etc. For example, where I work, which is “Lean-Agile”.
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 12:10 AM Beware sunk effort / cost on solution built too soon
From Me to Everyone: 12:11 AM For me its always about desirability, viability, feasibility
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 12:12 AM Design Sprints: http://www.gv.com/sprint
From Me to Everyone: 12:12 AM +1
From Cam Geer to Everyone: 12:13 AM used design sprint a lot
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 12:13 AM Einstein: Spend 55 mins on the problem, and 5 mins on the solution.
From Derick Grey to Everyone: 12:13 AM Look into Dual Track Design. Dont' just have a design sprint. Do vision design, and then always design.
From Dima Postnikov to Everyone: 12:14 AM Great session. Thank you.
From Derick Grey to Everyone: 12:14 AM Err Dual Track Development
From johnnyfromcanada to Everyone: 12:14 AM Dual Track Agile as well… Discovery & Delivery
