”Moon Coin” Tying the Digital World to the Physical (a discussion) & SSI is Coming Here

From IIW

SSI is Coming & “Moon Coin” Tying the Digital World to the Physical(a discussion)

Day/Session:Wednesday 1I

Convener:Mike Graglia & Jacob Siebach

Notes-taker(s): Timothy Robustelli

Discussion notes, key understandings, outstanding questions, observations, and, if appropriate to this discussion: action items, next steps:

“SSI is coming/here, society is built on registries, how must registries evolve given SSI?”

Registries connect people to stuff

How do we connect people to the digital

Future of Property Rights at New America > job help people in property rights world think about emerging technology to help them do their job better

Property rights is great for socioeconomic development

Blockchain for land registries last year

Write paper that explored Everest, Sovrin, and uPort

Arguably three important players in space

Assume SSI is successful worldwide, what does registrar do

IADB > builds asset registries, collatarize asset, get loan against that asset

Rare disease registry space > shitshow

What does a registrar do > buy land, spend money on notary to prove you are you, and sign document

As world becomes digitized, registrars are spending more time on identity

  • Recognize utility of SSI

Registries go from source of truth to issuers of verifiable credentials

WB spends so much time updating registries, then 10 years later, its helplessy outdated

If transactions are held in wallet, registries can be automatically updated

In the real world, when SSI is a thing, what will all the registries we depend on have to do differently?

Registries won’t go away, but will have to change

'Discussion '

What prevents registry updates from happening?

  • Why would some people bother?
  • Will says I have land, why would I take time out of my day to tell registrar
  • Leverage tech to automatically update it?

Titus: more than tech, think of incentives for people who don’t participate in the system willingly or properly

  • Punishment?
    • Taxes if you don’t update every 6 months or a year
    • Sell property and don’t update, fined
  • Punish people for life happening?
  • Punish people for not following worlds?

Punish for not complying with system…people say that you need to change the system

Data flow?

Registries, go away? Who issues credential?

Data that people don’t want in the domain, but that we still need to record

  • Bankruptcy?

Sari: Oracle problem

  • What do all these legacy systems and businesses do in the future
  • 2 new spaces
    1. Organization deals with oracle problem
      1. Land physically changing over time
      2. Somebody needs to connect physical to digital
    2. Different businesses that offer services for data disclosure
      1. Keep some private information private
      2. Services that help me curate information in the right way
      3. Help me self myself to digital services
      4. “Digital Bridges”

Can’t just have the carrot > need the stick?

  • Has been shown throughout history

Trust system has both

  • Good actors
  • Bad actors
  • Trust score fluctuates based on behavior

Can’t just hide stuff that we don’t like about ourselves, not OK

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Fix them or deal with them as they are

  • Not showing credit score
  • Not showing medical history

Trying to hide stuff?

  • “Have to disclose” is not the best way to approach it

Moon Coin > redeem coins for physical value

Push something into digital domain, extract it into digital domain seamlessly

  • How?
  • Do you need a registry to do this?

That’s just an exchange…I can convert my crypto

Registry creates value

  • Own house, protected by state, because I have record that says I own my house
  • Build something difficult that is of value

Abstract representation of value

  • Piece of paper is representation of something of value

Registries are valued because the public is interested in the information in the registry

  • Taxes
  • Cars
  • Animals?

Very differently handled in different countries

  • Denmark, land degradation
  • Valuation, property taxes, in govt interest
  • Some countries, jurisdictions have open data, some do not

Digital Identity of land, asset within registries?

  • Can’t use that identity even though data are public
  • Can’t see service end point?
  • Create secondary registry?
    • Making copies of registry?
    • Adding photographs of assets
  • Need end point to use data

Public registries, registries that state, organization manages Today, many are digital Society allows them to exist b/c they create value

Page Break

SSI and how do registries change?

  • Don’t just have SSI, and don’t just have state
  • Liminal time, things are changing
  • SSI w/ bad credit score, out there publically in a black box
  • W/ SSI build other things into it, that gives a bigger picture
  • Credit risk worth taking, based on recent positive behavior
  • Tool for redemption
  • Show more about what is in black box
  • All registry things will be richer for it
  • Role for state, get taxes, not going to go away

Birth registries > services?

  • State credentials denied to kids in border states b/c of midwives
  • Hospitals are trusted entities to issue birth certificate
  • Birth registry entitles person to request citizen from state
  • Same refugee from village, with SSI, village elder, aunt at birth, matches up to footprint, builds up a claim
  • Imagine it as a richer world

Digital and physical world coming together

  • Really want to tie it up


  • Are virtual worlds
  • Start up from Korea
  • Identity for gaming for next 5 years
  • Already be source of identity for Korean kids because already met them in digital world

1.5 billion w/o birth records?

  • People living totally in physical world
  • Should be able to enter digital world

Titus: credit scores are not black box, more encompassing and transparent

  • Know how to increase score
  • Good to bring in circumstances through SSI

Titus question: fundamentally strange to talk about SSI, states, registrars, one core power of SSI is to generate identity?

  • SSI believes that I am sovereign as myself
  • Now: tied to passport, driver license, bank account, birth certificate
  • Singular, atomic entity

Don’t exist in a vacuum

Jamie: e-government space, connecting people to registries

  • SK, Cananda
  • Allow people to register digitally
  • Can use verifiable claims based on their behalf to level up
  • Instead of creating identity on platform, can you bring SSI onto platform
  • Can it be transferable?
    • Should be able to take across jurisdictions

Lot of talk about people coming into fed govt

Innovation at local level

  • Recognition of property rights
  • is Mayor wants to provide services

Going to start to see federal governments confronted local solutions that are better

SK solution > consumable at federal level

Question: who are you working with in SK, scale?

  • 2015: build up in province
  • Working now with provinces and fed govt
  • User centric first, attaching things to user, and then making in consumable
  • Business using identity to having confidence that I am who I say I am
  • Confidence that people are who they are, digitalize interactions across lots of miles

Proves that it works bottom up

SSI = chooses to associate, others don’t

Some people choose not to be part of community, society

  • Attach myself to this

What you’re talking about is really agency?

  • Continue to have agency that you have in the physical world
  • Concept from Middle Ages, Catholic Church, subsidiary, means decisions should be made at the lowest government level possible
  • More buy-in along the way
  • Remarkable thing that we trust higher-up

But we can’t just build from top down for SSI, need to build from bottom up with agency and build trust up

Titus: difference between land registries and voting registries (voluntary somewhere)

  • Passive land owner in certain country > benefit from roads, infrastructure, electricity
  • Want to take things for granted
    • But can’t take those things for granted in SSI

Crumbling from top down?

  • DMV
  • Know this is a known problem, but not telling b/c don’t want people to not trust the system

SSI, decentralized registry

  • Verified by people in community
  • Say baby is born
  • Have biometrics, put into system
  • Verified by people there in community, certain number of people
  • GPS feeds into it
  • Certain levels of info

SSI allows us for richer, more complete data set

Whoever is in charge, will still want a more or less centralized registry

Why does mayor want that list?

  • Taxes, education, health, demographics
  • Vital records are step one

Not mutually exclusive > SSI and registries


  • Plumbing and check valves
  • Check valves can be built into system
  • Data goes out for public services
  • Really want that as a society
  • But need to re-build faith in it
  • New generation
  • Need to understand that everything on registry can be trusted



  • What mayor needs to predict public services
  • Data, statistics
  • Don’t need registries, only need information?

What if I don’t want to share that data?

  • Community consensus

Lots of services we take for granted, all informed by the census

  • Depends on society?
    • In some countries?

Phil and Jamie

  • Someone from Canada
  • For something in Canada, need to prove name, using driver license, passport, tribal identification document
  • All of these things layered on top of it, need PCTF before you can do other things
  • PCTF (Canada)
  • Some people don’t want to use tribal identification card b/c of discrimination
  • Foundational identity > service needs to know that you are a person, not that you’re a tribal person
    • Layer between the two
  • Verifiable claims that sit on wallet, SK holds wallet
    • Future…sees holder as citizen, and citizen and government

Denmark and Canada

  • Trust in state is high
  • How do we build pipes, user more and more in digital space, more control over data
  • How do registries stay current for purposes of state, and how do we still control our identity


  • Do transactions digitally through trust, confidence that I am who I am


  • Layered too high?
  • Communities do it their way based on local framework


  • Rare disease registries
  • Have to document it, can’t do research w/o registries
  • Registries are standardized
    • Researchers don’t know where to being
  • Point: when we allow everyone to be a little different, no standardization, allow for problems in the future, problems for interoperability
  • Really nice to have standardization for land registries
    • Polygon
    • Owner
    • Rights

Is SSI linked to registries?

Drummond Reed:

  • Talk about SSI
  • Point of layers
    • Three layers
    • Bottom: IDs
      • High-level interoperability
    • Second layer: SSI
      • Exchange of verifiable credentials
      • Digitally signed using DID layer below it so we can have trust
      • Schema for any credential is registered on public blockchain
      • No enforcement to use schema, but interoperability actually favors that
      • Better chance of smaller number of schema, but greater interoperability of credentials
    • Third layer: Wallet?
      • Agent to agent communication
      • Hand is built into digital wallet

Agent to agent communications at third layer?

Land registry > associate with a DID, if owners have a DID, along as connections persist, maintain connections, capability that wallet can do is to build policy frameworks for changes that take place

UPDATE, send message, update credential

Helps, doesn’t solve it

BC Gov

  • Businesses change names, use different name, type in wrong name
  • Building software that updates names automatically
  • Name change comes from a verifiable credentials
    • Built on layer of SSI
  • One register to another > Europe, only need a credential once
    • Held in one country
    • Share registry ID, all other entities that need data, can query data
    • Credential given once by authoritative issuer
    • Other registries do not keep old data

Titus: exchange of verifiable credentials

  • Registrars stop issuing credentials
  • Just use neighbors to start issuing verifiable credentials
  • Mike: 81% hackable
    • 4 neighbors just back me up
    • That’s when registrar says “that’s when you need me”

SSI: create minimal set of information in registry that you couldn’t before

  • Less risk of hack, less risk of honey pot
  • All valuable information is in the hands of the user

Joyce: early days of computing, didn’t put everything on computers and stop using paper, think that is what raised trust in what computers can do, but no everything gets hacked, mental shutdown, transitional time, add this and it will be richer, at some point, move things on register

  • Mike: registrars are going to need to interact with this for registries to begin