1M/ Toward a More Ethical Digital World: How to Think and Talk About Life in the Digital World
Toward a More Ethical Digital World: How to Think and Talk about Life in the Digital World
Tuesday 1M
Convener: Lisa LeVasseur
Notes-taker(s): Lisa LeVasseur
Tags for the session - technology discussed/ideas considered:
Me2B, Me2P, Me2T, Me2B Commitment
Discussion notes, key understandings, outstanding questions, observations, and, if appropriate to this discussion: action items, next steps:
Me2B as an ethos: Healthy, balanced Me2B Relationships are better for both Me-s and B-s.
Me2B reflects human rights + consumer rights.
Me2B is deliberately more on the side of the individual because of the current asymmetry in the relationship.
Not just about “Me-s”; reflects and respects truth of interrelatedness and interdependency; Me-s and B-s exist in social web/fabric, not in isolation.
The Me2B Commitment isn’t binary; there are shades of “grey” in the Me2B Relationship; both in the physical world and the digital world.
Revised the deck to incorporate the different kinds of Me2B commitments. Deck will be here soon: https://www.me2ba.org/resources
https://me2ba.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/me2b-101-for-iiw-31-toward-a-vocabulary.pdf
Will update with final url as soon as it’s posted.
Zoom chat:
From Danielle Batista to Everyone: Hi All, I am a PhD Student at UBC Vancouver and I am an Intern at Molecular Your where we are working on a solution for secure health data sharing using SSI
From Trev Harmon to Everyone: Hello everyone. I'm Trev Harmon, Certification Manager at ID2020. We are a non-profit working towards improving identity systems around the world through advocacy and technology work.
From Jeffrey Aresty to Everyone: Hi. Jeff Aresty, founder of internetbar.org and techforjustice.org - building trusted norms for the justice layer of the internet
From Zakir Suleman to Everyone: Hi everyone, I am a Master’s Student at UBC Vancouver and I am a UX Intern at Molecular You working on secure health data sharing using an SSI approach, and my research is at intersection of UX, Trust, and Blockchain systems.
From Marc Davis to Everyone: Hi everyone in Breakout Space M, my name is Marc Davis. I am a former UC Berkeley Professor, Yahoo!, and Microsoft, who works on inventing the future. I am focussed on the political economy of the internet and tools and policies for empowering people to have control over their digital identity and personal data.
From Oun Finema to Everyone: Hi, Oun from Finema, we are working on SSI development in Thailand both public and private sectors.
From Scott David to Everyone: Howdy. I am Scott David. 30 years as attorney. Now at applied physics lab. Doing “engineered policy” to support human interests in information technology systems. Apply compensating controls across BOLTS “business, operating, legal, technical and social” variables to help assure that “technically feasible” systems are also BOLTS reasonable
From Alan Cameron to Everyone: Hi everyone. I’m Alan Cameron, Director of Programs and Operations with iRespond which delivers privacy-protecting biometric identity solutions for the humanitarian and health sectors in developing countries.
From Scott David to Everyone: Important to demonstrate symbiosis in language of each stakeholder
From Fabiane Voelter to Everyone: Hi all, I am Fabiane, a Doctoral Researcher from Germany looking into user interaction with IS,, specifically blockchain-based Systems.
From Bob Wyman to Everyone: https://moralfoundations.org/
From skyberg to Everyone: “… By clicking, you agree that Company X and it’s affiliates….”
From Scott David to Everyone: Legal burden is surface of power relationship
From Bob Wyman to Everyone: In “normal,” physical world, we are constantly entering and exiting relationships. However, those relationships are often implicit while in the digital world they are often explicit.
From skyberg to Everyone: The self serving trickery of pretending customers are disinterested because they are simply overwhelmed.
From Jeffrey Aresty to Everyone: That's exactly the problem; creating trusted online communities where individuals and companies who join agree to norms, such as the ones you've described, changes the power play. Broad adoption is needed to make them relevant. That's why we work in the developing world.
From Scott David to Everyone: The phone is like a mining shovel, It is like a bank branch, a scoop for deposits/attention for fractional reserve lending/identity leveraging
From Tony Fish to Everyone: loving this
From Scott David to Everyone: Capitalism was “great” to conquer nature (extract resources). But now it has turned its extractive apparatus on us. Mary Shelley markets? BY the way, when I say “great” I am intentionally being ironic about the harms and suffering under colonialism, imperialism, etc.
From skyberg to Everyone: Volume is good
From mary hodder to Everyone: https://www.w3.org/community/privacycg/
From Tony Fish to Everyone: confusion - who knows what mobile or broadband tariff comparison are on. Compare utilities and flights. when in a utility/ commodity your only differentiator is confusion - you avoid direct comparision . when it is free …. confusion(squared)
From Scott David to Everyone: Joe Andrieu is a very clear thinker in the identity space.
From mary hodder to Everyone: Wouldn’t you have Me2B further back at the 2 hearts?
From Catherine Nabbala to Everyone: Nice one
From Chris Buchanan to Everyone: Surveillance implies unilateral action by the observer.
From Judith Fleenor to Everyone: The user doesn’t know the cost… often.
From Scott David to Everyone: Power relationships are embedded within the ceremony itself
From Marc Davis to Everyone: One of the reasons that TOS and PP are “contracts of adhesion” is that people do not “recognize the costs” of agreement.
From Scott David to Everyone: We need to alter the ceremonies
From skyberg to Everyone: Agree! I’d love to get the deck!
From Scott David to Everyone: Contracts of adhesion can also occur when you do know the costs, but are compelled to accept the bundle. It is a power abuse generally.
From Jim Fenton to Everyone: What’s the relationship between this initiative and Doc Searls VRM?
From Scott David to Everyone: Unconsciounability is a grounds for voiding a contract (ab initio - Ohhhh. Latin!) when parties don’t under the terms/costs. No meeting of the minds. Both Me2B and VRM have a theory of change of inverting the power relationships (See Derrida)
From Jim Fenton to Everyone: @Scott That’s what I was seeing too. What are the differences between them?
From Scott David to Everyone: The opportunity for inversion is here. Internet and COVID has dis intermediated ALL institutional relationships. How shall we reintermediate them? M2B and others are aspirations.
From Chris Buchanan to Everyone: Prosopagnosia causes serious social discontinuity and isolation. In the digital sense, it also causes security issues.
From Scott David to Everyone: Like a poster in my “lab” says: “Futurism: Building a fake future in the hope that the real future will come along and mate with it!”
From skyberg to Everyone: @David Scott, I love that? ^
From Scott David to Everyone: Economic power is a useful pathway to social and political power
From John Kelly to Everyone: Are their potential incentives outside the specific transaction or regulation that would move toward ethical Me2B? Is a 'subsidy' for a cleaner transaction ethic a possibility?
From mary hodder to Everyone: i’m muted
From Scott David to Everyone: Its like the t-shirt says “I cannot believe I am still protesting this shit!”
From Paul Dunphy to Everyone: re: the point about not being legally allowed to destroy art in Europe - I think the French are uniquely strict on that topic. Other countries in Europe are not.
From skyberg to Everyone: Seems like that starts with reducing the burden of understanding, right?
From Scott David to Everyone: Voting and consumer market behaviors have been hijacked by agenda laden, a-humanitarian considerations. United we stand. What is the vector of unification at present? Us to B?
From Brent Shambaugh to Everyone: One of my favorite business ontologies: https://github.com/valueflows/valueflows (open value networks)
From Scott David to Everyone: Substitute “negotiation” for current “notice/consent” choreography
From Lisa Levasseur to Everyone: www.me2ba.org
From James Manger to Everyone: id aliasing -> "you'll have nothing" … but you'll have nothing only for the 1% who take the effort to do the aliasing
From Me to Everyone: lisa.levasseur@me2ba.org
From Judith Fleenor to Everyone: Thanks for this background, history and interconnections information, Mary. Helpful.
From Judith Fleenor to Everyone: Thanks Lisa!
From Zakir Suleman to Everyone: Thank you very much for this talk, and your work!
From Tristan Nicolaides to Everyone: THANK YOU VERY MUCH LISA
